Over on DF, i mentioned in one of the many threads there, i've recently realized i've been running 2 spells wrong. So how would YOU handle the situation..
Do you tell the pcs "i screwed up. This is how the spell should be handled, and its going to be that way from here on out?"
Do you tell them "I screwed up, but we will keep using it that way, even though its wrong">??
The two spells in question are Command (L1 priest) and the reverse Bless (CURSE, L1 priest).
The Command i've three times now, allowed to be used ON undead, but the spell itself calls out that it CAN'T be used on undead. (OOPS!)
The other was Curse (the reverse of Bless). It lists NO info, on whether the targets OF the curse get a save, but i have been allowing them one..
Messing up a spell, do you change it later?
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Halaster-Blackcloak
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Re: Messing up a spell, do you change it later?
I would say that if everyone is happy with it and are used to how it is, why change it? It still stays balanced. For example, if you got rid of the saving throw for curse (reverse bless), that would make it a bit more effective against enemies...but it would also make it more effective when used against the PCs. If you keep it as you've been using it (with a saving throw), then both the PCs and their enemies benefit from that saving throw. So either way works.
I try to "correct" things to be more accurately BTB when I think it should be, but if we've been doing it in a way different from the rules and everyone is good with it, I just keep doing it that way.
As an example, wishes are generally rare in my games. Not super rare, but definitely uncommon. I like wishes to be special. And players wishing for greedy things doesn't happen often. My players - by some sort of gaming karma - have generally been really high quality and have (for the most part) tended to use wishes for the betterment of the party as a whole, or the kingdom, or whatever. Not often do they use it for self-gain.
But at one point someone got a wish and wanted to wish for a better ability score. I remembered the part about any score over 16 needing 10 wishes to be raised 1 pt. But because we never really dealt with that before, I thought I remembered the rule as saying that a wish can raise any ability score up to 15, but beyond that it takes 10 wishes. In other words, I completely forgot that wishes can only raise an ability score 1 pt, if the score was anything below 16. I remembered it as a wish being able to raise any ability score up to 16.
So I did it where if you had, say, a STR 9 and got a wish, that single wish could raise you up to a STR 16, but no higher. If you wanted to go to STR 16, you needed 10 wishes. Well, I remembered it half right.
Later, I realized that it was a mistake but we just kept doing it that way to be fair. Not that it came up more than once or twice ever after that. But it was one of those things where it didn't seem to matter. So bottom line, I'd say if you and the players are comfortable with how you've been doing it, why change it?
I try to "correct" things to be more accurately BTB when I think it should be, but if we've been doing it in a way different from the rules and everyone is good with it, I just keep doing it that way.
As an example, wishes are generally rare in my games. Not super rare, but definitely uncommon. I like wishes to be special. And players wishing for greedy things doesn't happen often. My players - by some sort of gaming karma - have generally been really high quality and have (for the most part) tended to use wishes for the betterment of the party as a whole, or the kingdom, or whatever. Not often do they use it for self-gain.
But at one point someone got a wish and wanted to wish for a better ability score. I remembered the part about any score over 16 needing 10 wishes to be raised 1 pt. But because we never really dealt with that before, I thought I remembered the rule as saying that a wish can raise any ability score up to 15, but beyond that it takes 10 wishes. In other words, I completely forgot that wishes can only raise an ability score 1 pt, if the score was anything below 16. I remembered it as a wish being able to raise any ability score up to 16.
So I did it where if you had, say, a STR 9 and got a wish, that single wish could raise you up to a STR 16, but no higher. If you wanted to go to STR 16, you needed 10 wishes. Well, I remembered it half right.
Later, I realized that it was a mistake but we just kept doing it that way to be fair. Not that it came up more than once or twice ever after that. But it was one of those things where it didn't seem to matter. So bottom line, I'd say if you and the players are comfortable with how you've been doing it, why change it?
Re: Messing up a spell, do you change it later?
What i am gonna do, is explain things on the 'curse' side, and ask the players what they would rather.. Keep things as is so both sides get the save (as we've played it) or go to the BTB method, no side gets the save.
BUT I am gonna switch command back to BTB, where it won't work on undead.. Though i am thinking of making it a specific Weakness for Kephrinn (one of my new undead)..
BUT I am gonna switch command back to BTB, where it won't work on undead.. Though i am thinking of making it a specific Weakness for Kephrinn (one of my new undead)..
Re: Messing up a spell, do you change it later?
As long as everyone cheats by the same rules, it's all good. If a mistake allowed the players an advantage, and you don't feel like correcting it, then the players will just have to tough it out when their opponents get that same advantage.
With a mistake on how a spell works, I would tell my players that I had made a mistake, then play it the right way going forward.
With a mistake on how a spell works, I would tell my players that I had made a mistake, then play it the right way going forward.
"No matter where you go, there you are."
Re: Messing up a spell, do you change it later?
This pretty accurately sums up my approach too. If the BTB approach is more logical or otherwise clearly better, then I'll change it (although I wouldn't retrospectively change anything that happened previously). However, if the accidental house rule was equally appropriate in terms of flavour and effectiveness of the spell, and everyone was happy either way, I'd probably just stick with it for consistency. However, if the player whose PC has the spell would prefer to shift to the proper rule, I'd be happy to go with their preference.Halaster-Blackcloak wrote:I would say that if everyone is happy with it and are used to how it is, why change it? It still stays balanced. For example, if you got rid of the saving throw for curse (reverse bless), that would make it a bit more effective against enemies...but it would also make it more effective when used against the PCs. If you keep it as you've been using it (with a saving throw), then both the PCs and their enemies benefit from that saving throw. So either way works.
I try to "correct" things to be more accurately BTB when I think it should be, but if we've been doing it in a way different from the rules and everyone is good with it, I just keep doing it that way.
In future games I'd most likely revert to the proper ruling though.