OOC Thread

[JadedDM]

Yes, it's unfortunate that I wasn't able to obtain this information sooner. Then again, it's always possible Breila may have failed the roll anyway (only a 50/50 chance). No sense in dwelling on it.

Still waiting for Targin and Jinali this round. Will update tomorrow either way.

[Jenara]

We'll be back tomorrow but i think Jerrard is up to date.

[JadedDM]

Exciting, isn't it?

[Breila]

[JadedDM]

(OOC: You are right about this module being unbalanced. If the ogre had hit Karathos, the minotaur would be dead and not the ogre. A lot is left to chance. And when Karathos hits, he kills.)

Actually, had the ogre hit Karathos, and assuming the ogre rolled max damage, it would have only knocked Karathos into negative HP. The only way the ogre could have killed him would be if he rolled a critical hit and did extremely well on damage.

What I meant by unbalanced, though, is that all of the combat encounters in this game are very, very weak...and the pre-gen characters are very, very strong. It's not limited to Karathos, although he is ridiculously overpowered. I thought the ogres would at least provide some challenge, but nope, you guys took them both out in less than 2 rounds.

Well, maybe Flint's Axe will be better balanced to provide challenge.

Anyway, what are they using to tie up the ogress? Galenye's magical Rope of Climbing or Karathos' silk rope?

[Breila]

Karathos's silk rope, for the time being.

I guess the module is meant for beginning roleplayers, who tend to take the death of their characters much more seriously than experienced players. I remember the first games I ever played were a little like this, leaving room for beginner's errors, and things got tougher as time passed.

[JadedDM]

Hmm...

Actually, you may be on to something there. I have noticed the module tends to give advice on things that anyone who has ever DM'ed before should already know. Like, really simple, basic stuff. I didn't really think about it, but yes, the module does speak to me as if this were my first rodeo.

Perhaps that's why I'm finding it so frustrating. Particularly as I don't believe in 'going easy' on new players. This trains them to believe they are invulnerable, to never use strategy (why bother, they always win without it) and to take victories for granted. And then when the time comes where things get tough, or their character dies, they are not prepared for it, and react poorly. (I speak from experience here--I coddled the heck out of my players in my early games, and it didn't turn out well.)

Well, on the bright side, now that I know this, I can adjust accordingly. There's actually only one battle left in the game, and that's the climax, so I can make sure to beef it up so it's not so painfully easy.

[JadedDM]

(Actually, how such a thing got into the land is a mystery! Bandits are unlikely, Ogres, even less so)

Not at all. Keep in mind that Solamnia covers over 500 miles of land. It's massive. The Knighthood doesn't come close to having the manpower to protect every road (and this isn't even a road--more like a well-maintained trail).

There's plenty of wilderness, mountains, and forests for ogres, bandits, and what have you to hide out in.

[Jerrard]

To me, that was what Erastin was thinking, he sees his land as something other than it is, he sees the glory of the Knights, forgetting the land is huge.

[Jenara]

Jaded I will be sending you a pm later today. Jerrard.

[JadedDM]

Okay, everyone listen up.

I have something very important to discuss, regarding this game and its continued existence. I even went as far as to lock the game thread, to sort of force everyone to actually look at this thread.

First off, I've been informed by Jerrard that he is quitting this game. Evidently, due to his recent medical problems, time has become a bit more of a precious commodity to him. He was forced to sacrifice one of the games he was involved with, and he chose this one. Why this one? He said he doesn't enjoy playing Erastin and isn't finding this module interesting.

Now, this by itself isn't a game-breaking problem. Rather inconvenient, granted--on account that Erastin is rather integral to this module (but only this one; after Knight's Sword ends, the emphasis on him drops substantially.) The ironic thing is, we're actually kind of close to finishing here. In fact, had we not wasted that month twiddling our thumbs, waiting for Gaia, we might actually be done already and this wouldn't even be an issue at all.

But...it didn't end there.

Literally six minutes after Jerrard tendered his resignation, I got a second PM by a different player. Whether this player wishes to identify himself or herself or remain anonymous is up to him/her. I don't really care. But the gist of this PM was, that the player in question was not enjoying his/her character or the module, either, and implied I also felt this way, and suggested we just put the kabob on the whole thing.

This player also said that another, equally anonymous player, felt the same way.

So in a five player game, we have one quitting and two others dissatisfied. That's a pretty clear majority, which means we really need to all sit down and hash this out. Here are my thoughts on the matter.

[Edited out venting and insecure hand-wringing; I really should have waited until I calmed down before writing this.] Namely, what are we doing here? Do the other players feel like this is worth pursuing or not?

For the record, I am enjoying this game. I mean, I was, when I thought everyone else was, too. Now, I don't even know. But I was frustrated with the lopsided encounters, and I did complain about that. Maybe I gave everyone the impression I hate this game, and that's what triggered this--I don't know. If so, I apologize for that. I was just frustrated with one aspect of the game. But when I learned this was a module designed for a rookie DM and players, I realized it was easily fixable; I just had to make the encounters harder. Problem solved. If I had figured that out earlier, there never would have been a problem in the first place.

But if nobody's actually having fun, what's the point of this? It's a game. The whole point of games are fun. If you are playing a game and not having fun, then you are wasting your time. So are you guys having fun?

The way I see it, we have three options here. They are:

1.) Continue as normal. We finish up Knight's Sword, move on to Flint's Axe. I'll either find a new player for Erastin, or just NPC him. When we get to Flint's Axe, it won't even matter, I can drop him entirely from the party, if I want. So no big deal. Obviously, if nobody is having fun here, then this is the worst option to take.

2.) Finish up Knight's Sword, then just end it. That way, we can get at least a little bit of closure. And it buys me a little more time to find something else to run. Of course, again, if you're all miserable here, there's little point in this one, either.

3.) The third option is to just put the kabob on the whole thing now. Lock down the forum and call it a day. At that point, I can either try and rustle up something else to run or we all just take a break.

Or maybe there are other options I haven't considered yet. In any case, I need to hear from everyone (except Jerrard, of course, who has quit) on this matter. Are you having fun? If not, is there any way I can salvage this game, or is it too late for that? If it is too late, what would you rather do instead, if anything?

Let's talk. Consider this game paused until we settle this matter one way or the other.

[HorizonsDream]

Okay, wow.

This comes as a big surprise to me. I was actually enjoying the game myself.

Here is what I think. If so many people are actually unhappy with the game, then I'm of the opinon that we should go ahead and drop the game even though I would love to go ahead and finish at least this module. Without a player for Erastin, it seems kind of pointless to do that though.

[Nuke]

Wow, where to begin....

First, I hope Jerrad didn't quit on my account, I was having fun role-playng Targin, trying to be the teacher, berating him when it was necessary in my opinion.

I do see that the encounter participation was some what limited, at least in terms of the number of PCs involved. Perhaps associated with the 'ease' of the battles.

I say it is up to you. and the others. but I would carry on personally. I am having fun.

If anyone has concerns or questions. or just wants to chat, PLEASE, feel free to post or PM. I almost feel like a wet blanket given the circumstances.

[Breila]

I'm not going to hide in anonymity, it was me who wrote the second PM (was pretty clear by now, I guess, since it's only me and my daughter left). I probably had been jumping to conclusions from Jaded's complaints that the encounters were unbalanced, and his message that he had his homebrew game almost ready but probably wouldn't have players to play it.

I also was frustrated by the fact that Karthos is kind of overpowered in damage, and underpowered in hits. He doesn't hit that often, and, given we have no healer in the group, is really in danger of being killed in battle, especially now that we're all weakened. But when he hits, he deals so much damage he kills. There is no in-between. No teaching the enemy a lesson and let him live.

Luna has told me repeatedly that she found it difficult to "warm up" with Jinali, and would rather play a character she set up herself in another game than this pre-gen.

So I wanted to let Jaded know I was/we were ready to change. I am sorry this came out as being dissatisfied enough to quit on the spot. I am still having fun, but not quite as much as in the other games I'm in, so I would be ready to scrapthis one and move on to something else. But only after finishing this module! And I will continue to prod Luna to post until it is finished.

If the rest of you want to continue wit Flint's axe, Karathos will remain as part of the group. Luna will probably stop then. After the summer, she will begin the school years which grades count for the final exam, which will of course limit her free time, even though she has fairly good grades (and average of what would be B- despite her dyslexia) and no minimum grades required for going on to study engineering, she wants to do as best she can...

[JadedDM]

So what I'm hearing here then, is that you all want to or are just fine with completing Knight's Sword, at the very minimum.

I would have to NPC Erastin, which does negate a lot of the point of the module, admittedly. I remember thinking, when we first started, 'what happens if Erastin dies'? It probably wasn't the best idea to make one character so essential to the storyline. But then again, I never would have expected Jerrard to quit, either. Guess I let myself develop a false sense of security on that front.

So I'll unlock the thread, and we can continue. When we reach the end of Knight's Sword, we'll have another discussion on what we should do, see if any minds have changed or what have you.